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Friday, May 24, 2013

346

Charming Uphill Both Ways in the Snow

Ask women or men to name a living, publicly recognized charming man, and 10 out of 10 will say [REDACTED]. That there exists only one choice—and an aging one—proves that we live in a culture all but devoid of male charm.

Name a living, publicly recognized charming man. (Actors, mostly.) The question accompanies this article about how men have lost their charm, which starts taking some odd but entertaining turns almost right away ("Even in the most casual conversation, men are too often self-absorbed or mono-focused or—more commonly—guarded, distracted, and disengaged to an almost Aspergerian degree").

(AHP, what say you?)

Tags:

men, movies, charm



346 Comments / Post A Comment

Chiara Atik@twitter

I knew it would be him without even clicking. It's just. The obvious [only] answer. How strange!

raised amongst catalogs

@Chiara Atik@twitter YESSSSSSS.

Bebe

@Chiara Atik@twitter The only option. My first thought was, of course, Cary Grant, then I saw they meant someone living.

jams

As well as the students and workers who took to the streets to demand that the foreign occupiers leave their land. Facebook hack

jams

Actually I read it yesterday but I had some thoughts about it and today I wanted to read it again because it is very well written. Seo Barcelona

jamsbond

This is well written article that is given here on the different set of tools available online. Good read and nice post.

is bubblegum casting legitimate

olivebee

This post was appropriately placed right after the one about JGL's film.

(I can't be the only one who finds him charming, right?)

annejumps@twitter

@olivebee I was just thinking that

Linette

@olivebee The moment I discovered JGL was charming: he did an interview in which the interviewer asked him how he prepared. JGL says he talks to himself in the mirror a bit. The interviewer, acting like this is the weirdest fucking thing ever, says really? You're kidding me.

And JGL side-eyes him and goes, "Everyone does that. Don't even pretend that you don't."

Charmed the hell out of me.

I wish I could find that damn interview now. I have no idea where I saw it.

Titania

@olivebee Oooh good contender! I do wonder, though, how much the charm actually depends on the age factor--the article seemed to think it was a surprised that Cary Grant developed charm rather late in life, and that Clooney is charming in spite of his age. I think its exactly the opposite--that kind of charm and playfulness has to appear as a contrast to a steady, solid persona of which age plays a huge part. After all, how do we know that JGL is genuinely secure and just charming rather than flaky or secretly a drug addict or a closeted gay man? Only after he sticks around and proves it to us time after time. If he continues on as he has, JGL in 10 years will be Clooney's charm replacement, no doubt about it.

Jill_Tata

Best thing I've seen all week!@k

raised amongst catalogs

I also find Lee Pace and Ty Burrell charming.

frigwiggin

@raised amongst catalogs

Neil deGrasse Tyson!

olivebee

@raised amongst catalogs Agreed on both, but A++++ to Lee Pace.

yeah-elle

@raised amongst catalogs Lee Pace is totally charming.

bb
bb

@raised amongst catalogs I love Ty Burrell too (not that I really know what he is like IRL), but for a sec I thought of Ty Pennington (the guy from Xtreme Makeover Home Improvement) and I was very, very surprised.

raised amongst catalogs

@frigwiggin Oooh, good one!

raised amongst catalogs

@bb GAH! What a terribly confusing moment that must have been for you!

Jocasta Carr

@olivebee My people! I don't know anyone IRL who likes Lee Pace, to which I say, watch "The Fall." I don't understand how he's not a bigger deal.

HereKitty

@raised amongst catalogs @olivebee @yeah-elle @Jocasta Carr DO NOT see "Lincoln," in which Lee Pace plays a disconcertingly convincing juicebox.

Queen of Pickles

@raised amongst catalogs
YES LEE PACE. THE FALL. Yes. I usher for New York Theater Workshop, and he was in one of their posters, and every time I'd see it, I'd sigh. Never saw the play though.

raised amongst catalogs

@Jocasta Carr I love that movie so much!

raised amongst catalogs

@HereKitty I actually enjoyed him in it just because it was so great to see him on the screen. I will fully admit that the whole time he was being nasty, in my head I was saying to him, "Pshhh, Lee, c'mon, you can't fool me."

Jocasta Carr

@raised amongst catalogs The Fall is just so, so good; I wish more people had seen/heard of it. I can't watch that movie without having all the feelings. Catinca Untaru is amazing and heartbreaking. And Lee Pace as the bandit in the story...*fans self* Yowza. Yow. Za.

Jocasta Carr

@HereKitty See, that just made me more into him because he's such a good actor. Even with the juiceboxiness and the stupid hair. And I was mad he was only in The Hobbit for like 2 seconds, though I cannot be anything other than extremely appreciative of any movie that has both him and Richard Armitage.

Atheist Watermelon

@Jocasta Carr Richard Armitage fwooooaarrrgghhh

sognodisonno

@raised amongst catalogs I thought of this guy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHnnAIm95bI

Who kind of reminds me of Lee Pace, so makes sense!

special_boots

Haha, yep. Wow.

Josh is like Germany Ambitious and Misunderstood

i was gonna say "Ask women or men to name a living, publicly recognized charming man, and 10 out of 10 will say Josh is like Germany Ambitious and Misunderstood." but that seemed like the most Josh is like Germany Ambitious and Misunderstood thing to say.

Ophelia

I was going to say "Bill Clinton," so I guess that's a little weird? I actually didn't even think of the "correct" answer.

you're a kitty!

@Ophelia ME TOO, I just assumed.

leonstj

@Ophelia - I learned the only semi-charming thing I can do from Bill Clinton! (How to shake hands. Someone told me when I was a pre-teen and he was beginning his first term that if I ever wanted to "be a man" I should learn to shake hands like that.)

meetapossum

@Ophelia Me three!

Lily Rowan

@Ophelia Bill Clinton was definitely my second answer.

Ophelia

@leon s Glad you clarified, because "semi-charming" and "Bill Clinton" does leave the door open for interpretation...

hallelujah

@Ophelia I don't even understand how he's not the answer. He's quintessential charm. George Clooney doesn't hold a candle to him! I'm unreasonably upset by this.

dj pomegranate

@Ophelia Yeah, I think because I know a few people who have actually met Clinton and they have said, "He's just so CHARMING!" And I always think of charm as related to but not the same thing as good looks...like, for my money, Clinton is not a looker but boy howdy would I watch him talk all night long.

Ophelia

@hallelujah Right? I feel like Clooney plays charming, Clinton IS charming. The man charms everyone. He visited my town when I was in middle school, and it was like, babies are charmed. Men are charmed. Women are charmed. Kids are charmed. Pets are charmed.

I suspect there's a backstory that involves a fairy godmother.

themegnapkin

@Ophelia Ditto! Although, maybe he's more charismatic than charming?

eiffeldesigns

@Ophelia Yes. I also thought of Bill Clinton first. That man can charm a stadium full of people (I know, he's done it to me twice). And while I agree, Mr. Clooney is quite the charmer- I'm not sure it rises to the same level.

iceberg

@Kirs whereas, purely because of what I know about his personal life and i think his wife is a BAMF, I think Clinton is gross, whereas Clooney could absolutely get it.

Ophelia

@iceberg Weirdly, though, in person, the power of his charm just knocks all of the grossness out, and leaves entire crowds reeling.

tussock

@Ophelia I thought of Tony Blair and then figured the 'right' answer must be Bill Clinton.

TheJacqueline

@Ophelia Me too! I definitely thought that was the only answer. I really want to meet Bill Clinton because apparently it is quite the experience.

whizz_dumb

@Ophelia Why'd you go and type out "semi-charming"? Now I have that Third Eye Blind song in my head, which is not pleasing.

blue_canary

@Ophelia He's a charm monster. Apparently, while he was in office, some Repub Congressional leaders hated taking meetings with him because before the meeting they disliked him, and after the meeting they disliked him, but during the meeting... woof! Just. So. Charming.

candybeans

@Ophelia Yep, add me to the list that thought that Bill Clinton was the only possible answer. I do think George Clooney is charming, but he isn't the first person to come to mind when asked about who is charming. Bill Clinton is, like, WIZARD-level charming.

Diana

@Ophelia

For the record, I have met Bill Clinton and I would like to confirm that he is charming as hell.

par_parenthese

@Ophelia FOR REAL charming. One of my friends went to high school with Chelsea and had dinner with the Clintons on the reg, and she said that not only is he absurdly charming in a not-at-all creepy way, but that he's also just wicked wicked smart.

Gordon Bombay

@Ophelia seconded. when I read the answer, I just figured I'd been in DC for too long.

leonstj

I agree that there's not a lot of charming guys out there these days, but I don't like the "Few Men Want To" idea.

I pretty much thought the entirety of "growing up" was going from "attempting to seem cool" to "attempting to seem charming". That and buying matching flatware.

Anne Helen Petersen

I was actually having this conversation with a friend earlier this week, and I don't think the article talks enough about how charm is linked to charisma, which is in turn linked to aura and "stars: they're NOTHING like us." So as stars become less and less...well, movie star-ish...and more and more reality star, than it's not surprising that charm will also diminish.

WITH THAT SAID, I think that charm is also the ability not to constantly mansplain.

Anne Helen Petersen

@Anne Helen Petersen ALSO ALSO it's no mistake that both the person mentioned by this profile -- and Cary Grant, the person to whom he's most often compared -- are "charming ladies men" who are also both rumored to be gay. Someone please unpack.

Faintly Macabre

@Anne Helen Petersen They do a little bit in the article! (Which I only skimmed due to low brain function today, so I can't expand on it.)

Lily Rowan

@Anne Helen Petersen I think charm is a little sexless -- a great date, but good in bed? I can't quite picture it.

laurel

@Anne Helen Petersen An essential part of male charm for me is the sense that the man genuinely likes women, e.g., sees women's essential humanity, not only their sexual objectivity. A man who seems to enjoy the company of women, as people or friends, is considered by people of limited empathy as emasculated, or "gay".

flimflannery

@Anne Helen Petersen Masculine and hetero enough that you want to date him, right? I'd call it hetero-passing. Like, you'd want the dinner, the new experiences, the flowers, the cuddling. But I don't think of either of those dudes being overtly sexual (like say, a Ryan Gosling, where his hotness is tied to having sex with him). A Clooney or a Cary could be/are charming towards women and see a lot of them, maybe just not in the bedroom. *

*I've heard tell of someone seeing Clooney and Danny DeVito headed off to a hotel room with three young ladies a few years back, so the rumors cut both ways?

harebell

@Anne Helen Petersen

so true about not mansplaining!

I liked the article a lot, but feel like it got a little excessively negative/suspicious at the end. One of the reasons charm is charming, and not just gross manipulation, is that the charmer usually can accept appearing vulnerable and can be vulnerable without being needy. Also, can charm while being generous to the other person -- not contemptuous! -- because recognizing we are all human and fallible.

Linette

@laurel I think charming is essentially the ability to quickly grasp what the person in front of you most wants, coupled with the ability to deliver it. So if the person in front of you wants to be found attractive, you flirt mildly; if the person wants to be thought interesting, you look fascinated in their stories, etc.

This is why pscyhopaths are so frequently described as charming. It's a really good way to get people to do what you want them to do. (Not that all charming folks are psychopaths; lots of people want to give people what they want just because they are nice people and want others to feel appreciated.)

dj pomegranate

@Linette That is a really good observation!

par_parenthese

@Linette Exactly right, also, why are you so smart, seriously. Pinners are the greatest.

Linette

@par_parenthese *blush*

pollypeachum

I feel like the only person on Earth immune to the charms of George Clooney; he's just so 'eeehhhhhhh' to me in every single way, which is a puzzlement to practically everyone I know. IDK my tastes are weird anyway. (Plus his acting doesn't really do it for me...Actually that's probably the biggest reason why I don't care for him.)

Ophelia

@pollypeachum You are not alone.

olivebee

@pollypeachum Oh man. I think my husband/friends are so tired of hearing me say, "Oh god, another George Clooney movie?? Can't we get some new, fresh talent in film these days?"

SarahP

@pollypeachum I have never cared for him either way except in Burn After Reading, in which I thought he was hilarious.

yeah-elle

@pollypeachum You are not alone. Upon reading the intro here, I automatically thought of George Clooney, but I also thought, "10 out of 10 people also mistake suffocating smugness for charm."

pollypeachum

@olivebee I feel like he plays himself every, single time and yes, there seem to be a lot of people who only play themselves in movies right now (much to my chagrin), but with some people you can tolerate it but not him. I'm really in need of actors who can ACT things other than themselves right now, dammit.

pollypeachum

@yeah-elle I feel like if one goes on a date with George Clooney, he'd spend the whole night talking about how great he is.

olivebee

@pollypeachum You took the words right out of my mouth. I also feel that same way about Brad Pitt.

yeah-elle

@pollypeachum He'd spend the entire time making mildly uncomfortable and inappropriate jokes before laughing at himself, and bringing up "causes" so he could discuss how he "is really devoted to making a difference." He'd smell like self-tanner, colognes layered over other colognes, and rancid self-satisfaction. If you turned him down at the end of the night, he'd chuckle and ignore you in favor of putting his hand just low enough on your back for you to be like "WHO SAID YOU COULD GRAB MY ASS?" And the whole time, he'd be flashing bleach-y smiles at no one, just off into the ether, just in case??

pollypeachum

@yeah-elle I think in that case, one's best plan of attack is to order the most expensive everything off the menu, have a wonderful meal as he's jabbering excuse yourself to the bathroom, climb out the window and take a cab home, sticking him with the bill.

This might require some research beforehand to make sure one is not stuck in a bathroom that's up on the tenth story (one just wants to ESCAPE), but it's worth it to avoid dealing with that charmer in the end.

yeah-elle

@pollypeachum You wouldn't even feel bad because you know that he would just keep Clooning™ like a tractor beam until someone accidentally made eye contact with him, at which point he'd not even recognize that it was a different person, and he'd be like, "Gosh, where'd ya go, did ya fall in, ah ho ho ho oh I crack myself up sometimes, geez, anyway, as I was saying..."

Arwen

@yeah-elle YES. This perfectly articulates my dislike of clooney!

savanner

@yeah-elle
AAHH my computer is only posting the first half of my comment, but I was trying to say: Gilderoy Lockhart!

SarahP

That article is proof of the idea that if you say a word over and over it begins to lose its meaning.

pollypeachum

@SarahP Charm charm charm charm charm charming charm charm charm charmingly charmingson charm charm charm charm charmster charmer charm charm charm charm charm charm charmant charmin' charm charm charm charm charm charm charm charm charm charm charm charm CHARM.

Helvetica

@SarahP & pollypeachum

Onymous

@SarahP The whole thing just started to sound like nonsense syllables after the first two paragraphs.

If I was an english teacher I would give it a D+ and write NEEDS TO BE ORGANIZED in big red letters with lots of arrows.

pterodactgirl

It's not their fault. When Cary Grant died on November 29, 1986 (a day that shall live in infamy) the source of all charm in the universe was extinguished. Since then we've seen other men exhibit varying degrees of magnetism, glamour, agreeableness, attraction, charisma, and even pizzazz, but true charm is sadly extinct.

A moment of silence for what was lost, ladies.

pterodactgirl

@raised amongst catalogs

dj pomegranate

@pterodactgirl

special_boots

I've dated more than my share of charming guys, I think because I'm so awkward and prickly that it takes a lot of charm to get close to me, and I found some of the Atlantic article's observations to be uncannily accurate.

I've been on-and-off involved (for years!) with the most charming guy I've ever met, and I do think it has a lot to do with why I've never trusted him; it's even something we've discussed at some length. It's an act, I know it's an act, I see you do it to everyone -- how can I possibly believe that it's "real" when you do it to me?? He claims there's a difference, but I've never quite bought it.

Had to send him the article even though we're in a very very off stage right now.

iceberg

@special_boots I dated a "charming" guy, andf I bought it whiolesale at first, but when I saw how he did it to everyone it definitely lost its sheen.

Linette

@special_boots Aw, I like charming guys. A lot of them, anyway. I think it has to do with the ability to turn it off and on. If they do it for everyone, it's kind of narcissistic, like they just want to be universally thought awesome. But if they do it just when they actually want people to feel liked, then I find charm pretty delightful.

My dad is a charming guy, and he is charming at, like, the dry-cleaner lady, and the waiter at restaurants, and you can see how it makes their day. I think it's pretty great. But he will categorically refuse to be charming at people he dislikes, or that he has no desire to make feel good for whatever reason. Or when it would be wildly inappropriate.

Point is: big difference between charming for the charmer's sake, and charming for the charmed's sake.

Linette

@Linette . . . and now none of those words look real.

RubeksCube

@special_boots My dad is a "charming man", and as @Linette pointed out, he is a charmer for the charmed's sake. He does it to everyone, but he is so friggin genuine. He loves people, is the best listener, etc etc. I think, as someone pointed out upthread, he is also often seen as either asexual or as potentially gay. It baffles people when they discover that, not only does he mean what he says/how he acts, but he doesn't want anything from them. So..they exist, is what I'm saying? That was a really long anecdote for not a lot of payoff. Ha!

Linette

@RubeksCube I do think a lot of straight guys are ONLY charming for the purposes of getting laid, and therefore if a guy is charming and not getting laid, the presumption is that he's not straight.

Those guys are foolish, though, because being charming for the joy it brings people pretty much always elicits a great reaction. You made them feel special, and now they'd like to do something nice for you! That something isn't always sex (or even most of the time), but it is pretty cool to see the endless round robin of being-nice-to-one-another that ensues.

Waiter: "You made my day, so I brought you free dessert!"
My dad: "You brought me free dessert, so I charmed your manager and told him you were excellent to us."
Manager: "You made me feel like I do a great job at managing my people, so now I will remember your name every time you come in."

And round and round it goes. Well-done charm is awesome. But as with all great assets, in the wrong hands . . .

raspberryfool

@special_boots A couple of months back I broke things off with a long-term (several years) charming boyfriend who just wasn't ultimately trust-able. I'm a bit quiet and antisocial, so charming types are more likely to get in close and he definitely was AMAZING at making me feel special. He was amazing at making everyone feel special. Which is great with dry-cleaner ladies & waiters as @linette mentioned. But I found him unable to be disliked - continuing conversations/charm sessions with everyone, no matter his true feelings. And I caught him many times fudging the truth with others to hide bad possible reflections on himself. Ultimately, I found out that he'd lied to me about a ton of things, some big some small, in order to not look bad. Which in retrospect was stupidly obvious, but at the time was really jarring. And you just can't keep a relationship going if you've got to wade through PR before you can get to your partner. I dunno. I tend to love charm and well-used charm, but it's kind of thrown my dating preferences for a loop. I'm scared of potential doublespeak now, even if the users ultimate intentions are benign.

RubeksCube

@Linette SO TRUE. As Uncle Ben so wisely observed, "with great power comes great responsibility." Real charm is definitely a great power.

SarahP

I find that the charming people in my life are alluring but exhausting, and I am much more at home with the "almost Aspergian" types I know.

fabel

@SarahP I think I agree. I also used the word "charismatic" as practically a slur sometime recently, so there's that.

There's just about charm and charisma that can be linked and/or bordering on narcissism? (Or maybe I've been reading too many "are you a sociopath?" lists, where "charm" is always preceded by "superficial")

TheBelleWitch

@SarahP I'm with you. I may like the company of some charming people, but I don't think I've ever fully trusted them. "Alluring but exhausting" is a good way to put it.

Blackwatch Plaid

@SarahP Having dated a sociopath, I have definitely been turned off of charm. My boyfriend now actually is aspie, and it's working out famously. Too much charisma is sort of grating.

OhMarie

I was just talking with some friends about how some celebrities can do tough things that are not in their wheelhouse through sheer force of charm.

Key examples: Justin Timberlake and The Rock on SNL. They are reasonably funny but not actually comedians, and do a great job just out of charisma.

yeah-elle

@OhMarie Haha, I just mentioned The Rock downthread. He is charming.

dj pomegranate

@OhMarie Oh, Timberlake! Good one.

Faintly Macabre

Morrissey?

limnupon

@Faintly Macabre Since when is being self-absorbed the antithesis of being charming? Obviously, you can be the embodiment of both.

lalaura

@Faintly Macabre The article pointed out how "charming man" used to be, like "longtime bachelor", a polite code for gay. That made the Morrissey song click into place for me.

hallelujah

I know plenty of charming men, although I work in politics, so that's to be expected. Granted most are also sociopaths and/or perverts, so.

yeah-elle

I don't think George Clooney is charming. I mostly think he has eau de frat boy smug, really.

Besides that, if we're talking about charm in celebrity men, I think there are plenty of candidates? Someone mentioned Lee Pace upthread. I think Chris Pine is pretty charming. Plus actors that have transcended their original niches by way of being good natured and having personality, like Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson, who has always struck me as being charming.

raised amongst catalogs

@yeah-elle BILL PULLMAN. How did I forget Bill Pullman?!

yeah-elle

@raised amongst catalogs Yes! Also, different types of charm.

Endearing charm: Lee Pace
Huge but secretly a geeky marshmallow charm: The Rock
Crinkly eyed ex-English major charm: Chris Pine
Aggressively flirtatious and self-aware arrogance charm: RDJ
Geek in the body of a god charm: Karl Urban

These men all have tons of genuine charisma, in their own way. I think what strikes me as un-charming about George Clooney is that it doesn't seem genuine at all.

you're a kitty!

@yeah-elle I was like HOW LONG IS IT GOING TO TAKE SOMEONE TO MENTION RDJ JEEZ so thank you yes.

laurel

dj pomegranate

@laurel Amy Poehler is charming!

laurel

@dj pomegranate She completely and absolutely is.

whizz_dumb

@laurel I swoon for her.

laurel

@whizz_dumb How could you not?

whizz_dumb

@laurel She's perfect *creepy whisper*

laurel

@whizz_dumb Smart, funny, beautiful, successful, nice: the total package.

Just look at how George is improved by proximity to her--he seems funnier and more relaxed than usual--while she remains undiminished.

LilRedCorvette

@dj pomegranate This is clearly the golden age of charming ladies (layyyyydies!). Follow-up article!

whizz_dumb

@LilRedCorvette yeah, why are we wasting our time assessing men? They (we) are so base there's nothing to analyze. The charm is a front, a ruse. Let us dwell on the awesomeness of ladies like Amy Poehler and the likes.

laurel

@whizz_dumb

whizz_dumb

@laurel hahaha that one rules. keep 'em coming.

honey cowl

@laurel I love this.

thebestjasmine

@laurel One of the best things about this was the subtext: that Clooney never dates women as "old" as Poehler, that Poehler just got a divorce and has been looking smoking hot ever since. I love everything about this gif.

LilRedCorvette

You say "Charming", I say "Potato". It has nothing to do with his persona, it's just a Pavlovian response.

Ophelia

@LilRedCorvette No, I think you're right. He DOES have the personality of a potato.

fondue with cheddar

I don't trust charming men.

whizz_dumb

@fondue with cheddar I will charm the shit out of you.

stuffisthings

I mean with the whole min/maxing trend these days I guess a lot of guys are just not putting enough points into Charisma.

oxla?

@stuffisthings i usually will max out my primary stat and just take astral speech in case i need to feat my way out of trouble. but, you know, different strokes for different demi-humans.

iceberg

Yeah I knew who redacted was without even clicking over. I buy his charm though, and I'm glad he seems to use it for good instead of evil.

eiffeldesigns

My ex-husband was charming. He was also an asshole. Possible sociopath. So. There's that.

whizz_dumb

I'm too silly self-deprecating to be charming (consistently).

iceberg

OMG how could we forget the Charmer in Chief???

fondue with cheddar

@iceberg YES BARRY I DO PLEASE

Ophelia

@iceberg HE IS SO FOXY

honey cowl

@iceberg Ohhhh man.

pajamaralls

@iceberg Seriously.

On a related note: Joe Biden could charm me allll day.

Bebe

@iceberg BRB, watching this on repeat for the next 3 hours ; http://live.wsj.com/video/obama-sings-al-green-let-stay-together/6203E851-BBD2-43AB-B543-0B3053C32DAD.html#!6203E851-BBD2-43AB-B543-0B3053C32DAD

fondue with cheddar

@Bebe I LOVE THAT VIDEO

EpWs

LOOKIT THIS PICTURE THE INTERNET FOUND OF HIM CHECKING FOR RAIN:

fondue with cheddar

@The Everpresent Wordsnatcher STEP OFF WHITE HOUSE AIDE UMBRELLAS ARE FOR WUSSES

Alexmen

Everpresent Wordsnatcher STEP OFF WHITE HOUSE AIDE UMBRELLAS ARE FOR WUSSES...Gomberg Law

cuminafterall

I have met the father of the man in question and I'm pretty sure he's more charming than his son. Even at 79.

pollypeachum

I don't think I get charm period. I think it's the writer in me that longs more the specific than the generic (i.e. uses words in a beautiful fashion, will totally have long discussions with you about Shakespeare, is willing to do absolutely crazy things for the sake of them being fun, actually has a sense of humor that IS a sense of humor, if that makes any sense). "Charm" just seems to have nothing backing it, like you say someone is "charming" and then you need to add a descriptor why because otherwise all I'm picturing is some slick-haired, thin-moustached gigolo in a red velvet smoking jacket.
Then again you are talking to the person who was born without the flirting gene and cannot even recognize when other people are flirting with her.

SoBeana

Happy to see Chris Pine pop up a few times, surprised I have not seen Neil Patrick Harris. His charm and dapper personality are the only things that make Barney work on any level. And he seems like such a pleasure to be around in general.

EpWs

@SoBeana HEARTILY SECONDED

dj pomegranate

David Tennant: charming/not charming?

(MY VOTE: CHARMING.)

chrysopoeia

@dj pomegranate SECONDED

Jinxie

@dj pomegranate Oh, ABSOLUTELY. And that's only partially to do with the Scottish accent.

yeah-elle

@Jinxie But the Scottish accent doesn't hurt. Also see: James McAvoy, professional walking vortex of charm.

you're a kitty!

@yeah-elle SECONDED an SECONDED. James McAvoy is not at all classically my type, and yet, oh my GOD. Have you SEEN his BBC Macbeth?

David Tennant is 100% my type and also seems unbelievably sweet and genuine and enthusiastic about everything, so that was a foregone conclusion.

yeah-elle

@you're a kitty! Yes! I love that whole series of remade Shakespeare plays. It was a brilliant decision to put Macbeth in a restaurant kitchen.

par_parenthese

@dj pomegranate RIDICULOUSLY charming. To all who cross his path, regardless of gender, age, orientation. Here is where I tell everyone to go to YouTube and watch his episode of Never Mind the Buzzcocks because D-damn.

@yeah-elle But James McAvoy (though he makes me lose my train of thought when I see pictures of him, he's so attractive) is a little too... prickly genius to be really charming, I feel like?

yeah-elle

@par_parenthese But, but...

I dunno, I think he can be kind of a goofball and is pretty candid in his public persona, which is charming to me.

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@yeah-elle Is this where I add that according to all the points the writer of this article raised about charm being related to the ability to identify and empathize with women, David Mitchell is totally, completely, overwhelmingly charming...?

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So can someone here elaborate on the difference between phony/sleazy charming and genuine/accidental charming? I haven't thought about that much but from reading these comments it seems like that's a line to be drawn.

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@whizz_dumb I've found that the more attractive they are, the more phony it comes across.

cuminafterall

@whizz_dumb genuine/accidental charming is Hugh Grant in movies, phony/sleazy charming is Hugh Grant in real life.

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@whizz_dumb
phony/sleazy = overtly trying to get in your pants in a gross-ish, don't-care-what-your-opinion-is way,
genuine/accidental = hey it would be lovely if we did it, because you are clearly awesome, but I'm just as happy just talking to you.
(just my opinion, can also be no sexual connotation to genuine charm, but it's more fun when there is!)

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Whither Jon Hamm? Delightful in all talk show appearances, Sesame Street, comedy programs, etc., and plays a grade-a bastard on Mad Men as counter-example. He gains further charm points with the Fey/Poehler Friendship Endorsement.

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@Cakebot Did you see him on Rookie's advice from an adult? Very charming.

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I prefer my charm to not come with a side of manipulation.

Steve Martin. Tom Hanks. Steve Carrell. They're charming and sincere.

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@blueberry mary Stephen Colbert, in non-Colbert persona. But often in persona, too.

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@Linette I love him. No, actually, I lurve him. *sigh*

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@blueberry mary my giant impossible crush on Steve Martin is long and abiding.

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@blueberry mary Ah, yes! Yes! Have you seen the YouTube vids he's done with Edie Brickell for their new album? And did you know Martin Mull was a gifted painter?

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@alliepants YES!
Don Draper is charismatic as all hell, but not at all charming.
But Jon Hamm doing comedy? Charm out the wazoo.

lucy snowe

I'm probably alone in this, but every time I see Jackie Chan, in movies or in interviews, he charms the socks off of me. He just seems delightful. And happy to be alive.

iceberg

@lucy snowe No he is truly charming, in a twinkly sort of way! I think we would just smile happily back & forth at each other if we met.

lucy snowe

@iceberg Yes! And then he'd do something amazing, like run up a wall to fetch you a little flower from a high planter...

Lucienne

@lucy snowe Jackie Chan, yes!

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@lucy snowe long time lurker, first time commenter, just needed to chip in and say I MET JACKIE CHAN!! And goddamn, he was charming. He was speaking at a children's charity event in Thailand (I went because I was volunteering at one of the charities his foundation was donating to). He was absolutely delightful, made time to speak to everyone, and even tolerated my multiple questions about his Mulan music video (I freaked out a bit...)

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@gnomes I am so jealous! That sounds amazing!
(I would also freak out!)

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I also find John Legend pretty charming, but in a very grounded, down-to-earth sort of way. He's so together he can just relax and pay attention to the people he's with.

Laughable Walrus

@lucy snowe oh my god John Legend! He was completely not on my radar, and then he played at an event I went to. HOOO BOY he charmed me into an eternal crush.

lucy snowe

@Laughable Walrus For me it was a recent combo of his guest-judging on Project Runway, singing with an owl on Sesame Street, and doing a gorgeous cover of "True Colors" at the TED conference. I am well and truly sunk. *swoon*

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Bob Hoskins! I may be alone in this... but those crinkly eyes! That accent! I melt.

pajamaralls

I still find Channing Tatum charming. He seems sweet, he's funny/makes fun of himself, and dances.

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@pajamaralls Yes! I never thought he was all that handsome, strictly-speaking, but then I saw him in a few interviews and found him to be absolutely delightful.

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OK, since I am home and shamefacedly watching TV in the middle of the day - Waiting to Exhale is on VH1, btw - I would like to add the late, great, Gregory Hines to our list of charming men. Swooning.

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@Bebe Forever swooning.

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@you're a kitty! I've been in love with him since approximately 1986. I wholeheartedly agree, and am hugely jealous that you met him!

Bus Driver Stu Benedict

Did anyone mention Dick Cavett yet? I feel the article is mistaking affability for charm. And, at least to me, men who have broad tastes are more charming. And that involves a certain... ambiguity? (Tony Randall also came to mind.) Sorry, dudal archetype bros, your unimaginative performance of your gender doesn't float my boat...

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I'm never quite sure how I feel about charming people. I've only ever known a few, and while they make for delightful conversationalists, and they always brighten your day, I often find myself a bit suspicious of how nice they're being to me. (I think I have some sort of sense that, as a personality quality, charm - unlike kindred but perhaps more unstudied qualities such as kindness, bubbliness, conviviality and whatnot - is very much an appurtenance of the 'bright young thing' set or its modern equivalent; something which doesn't quite belong in my sphere of life. It's as if someone had started being suave, out of the blue. Or debonair. Or urbane, or rakishly good-looking. I wouldn't know what to do with it.)

Still, as far as the article survey goes, either they didn't look very hard for charming people, or they asked a very limited selection for their choices. Off the cuff I would suggest Rupert Everett, Shahrukh Khan, Stephen Fry, Mikhail Baryshnikov, Toby Stephens. Richard Armitage in a repressed, smouldering sort of way (@Didldid 'fwooooaarrrgghhh'
indeed!). And I'm with @blueberry mary qua Tom Hanks and Stephen Colbert, and @dj pomegranate re David Tennant, but I'll also add John Barrowman to that particular list :0)

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I'm surprised nobody I've seen has mentioned Ryan Gosling. He's constantly making women swoon and some of his interviews are so spot on I'd swear they were crafted by a team of publicists to specifically be charming.

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